This interview is just one of the many that took place for “A New Generation of Buddhist Young Practitioners,” the cover feature of Mandala July-August 1998:

How did you meet Buddhism?

My mother was a student of Lama Yeshe and Lama Zopa. She traveled with her cousin Ven. Roger Kunsang about 25 years ago and I think they ended up at Kopan and did a course there. Eventually my mom came back to the West and ended up in America and eventually had a family.

Throughout my childhood my mom didn’t mention Buddhism and never put her beliefs on me. In retrospect, I can see where what she said came from. At the time they were words of advice without labels – just words of advice from my mom. I think she had faith that if she steered me in the right direction I would end up there. For a long time it wasn’t looking like I would end up there, but I admire her very much for having the faith she did. Finally things just came about where I ended up in a Buddhist place.

I met Lama Zopa Rinpoche when I was 10. My mom brought my two younger sisters and me to Milarepa Center in Vermont. She went to a weekend retreat and Lama Zopa Rinpoche was giving some teachings. I remember playing soccer in the fields and having fun. I vaguely remember Rinpoche asking if he could take me with him. My mom was like, “This is my son!” I remember that Rinpoche told me to write something down, and when I recently found that piece of paper it was Chenrezig’s mantra and a prayer for blessing the food. It was a very brief meeting that I vaguely remember, and Rinpoche also says he vaguely remembers the meeting.

Physically, that was my only meeting with Buddhism, and once in a long while I would find a book around the house, but I would look at the title and walk past it. I also remember during that time Roger and my mother walking up in the woods together, talking. Those are the only memories I really connect with Buddhism. In that sense I’ve never had any real contact. I hadn’t had much Buddhist experience up until I found a pamphlet for Karma Choeling Center when I was 19. This directly led to my decision to go to Milarepa Center and live there, which is where I met Ven. Thubten Kunsel.

What kinds of hardships did you face when you were growing up? What about your teenage years was difficult?

I remember when I was 6 or 7 I already felt really confused about the world. I couldn’t understand what was going on; it was puzzling to me what my life was about. I wanted to be a veterinarian for a while, and then later I wanted to be a baseball player, and finally I wanted to be a stockbroker. I evolved from wanting to help – being a child and seeing animals and wanting to help them; to totally enjoying myself – being a ballplayer; to finally making lots of money. I could have all these things, and recognition.

When I went through junior high school I was very confused. When my friends began to change and do fun things, I would sit back and wonder what was the purpose of my life. I didn’t have much motivation to do anything. I couldn’t figure out what I would end up doing, or why. I was about 14 at this point.

What were your friends doing that seemed like fun?

It was just the social scene – hanging out with this group and that group. That’s where I didn’t want to have anything to do with it. I saw my friends’ personalities changing completely, trying to fit into this and this and this. I didn’t really want that to happen to me, so I sort of pulled back.

It was mostly the fact that groups of people – you could say cliques – were forming, and all of that just turned me off. This just led me to more despair. I also remember I would be overcome by extreme migraine headaches, and I would come home from school and lie in bed, unable to move. I went to school and came home and got in bed and that was it. It just made things worse. I began to ask what was the point of this pain.

In high school I started to be more active, mainly through sports. I was always playing sports when I was a kid.

What kinds of problems did you face in high school?

Like I said, it was not wanting to fit into any group, and my friends sort of drifted away from me. I made some new friends, but basically I was withdrawn. Beginning with that it made the next few years difficult because I couldn’t figure how to fit in, or why.

Did you feel peer pressure about it?

No, I just felt awkward, not being accepted. When I chose not to be accepted, I felt the consequences of not being accepted, I felt really awkward. I felt really out of place. I chose not to be accepted and I had to live it – I felt separate and lonely and confused, and still had the same questions about life. Nothing really changed except the external things.

Did you ever use substances to help you?

Yes, as I progressed. I began to drink around age 13 or 14. I chose not to fit in, and I didn’t want to go to school anymore. What could I learn in school that would help me understand my life any better? I didn’t see that school was going to be of any benefit in the big picture. I didn’t want a career, and that’s what school is about. I wanted to know what is the purpose of this body on this planet, and I didn’t think school was going to help me.

Soon enough I decided not to go to school, but was forced to go. Eventually I got drunk with a bunch of friends one night, and I stumbled around laughing, falling down stairs, not caring – it was great. I didn’t remember what had happened, and all that time had passed. It made sense to me: I have to pass some time – I’ll just get drunk! I would drink before, during and after school, just to get through. I didn’t understand what was happening, but I had to get through, so I decided to get through and not remember what happened.

My mom got worried about me and tried to help me by putting me in some counseling. It didn’t help my mind at the time, but it made me very, very angry. I quit drinking because it was almost impossible with so many restrictions. Eventually I just replaced it with drugs. My mom was checking if I was drunk, and not being drunk I could be high.

I got into marijuana and would smoke pot before, during and after school – same thing, different object. I didn’t want to be living the way I was living, but I couldn’t see how I could change. Growing up as a teenager in America, these opportunities come up, so I tried them and thought it was good.

In retrospect, do you think your friends were facing similar difficulties?

Yes, definitely. At the time I didn’t think that way. I thought I was the only one that was having it this bad – the only one sitting in my room feeling really pissed off about life – I’m the only one. I’m the only one who wants to get drunk and forget about it all. I felt like, “Poor Brandon – I’m the only one who has it this bad.”

When I think about it now, my friends had it just as bad. They didn’t want to show anyone, whereas I just didn’t care. If people saw I was really screwed up, I just didn’t care. Some of my friends had some conscious thoughts that they wanted to be accepted, but it didn’t matter to me. I think they had the same pressures, same family problems and worries, same drug and alcohol problems – they just dealt with them differently.

Where did all of this lead?

The drug and alcohol problems led to problems with the police, the law, school principals. When I had my rights restricted I became very upset and eventually I just didn’t want to deal with it. At first I felt it was like a game, like I could be some sort of scam artist and try to get around the rules and problems. I thought I could be really conniving and sneaky, but it was difficult because there were always people watching.

When I realized it took more effort to avoid the problems than to get into them, I decided I wanted to go somewhere else and be who I wanted to be. I ran away when I was 15, and I convinced my biological father who lives in Chicago to let me stay with him. I only told him what I wanted him to hear – he said, “Oh yes, you can stay, it sounds terrible there.” I made it sound really horrible, as if they were after me. I just lied, I completely lied.

I stayed with him, which led to more drug use – harder drugs. I stayed with him for a summer. He wanted me to go to school, so I tried school again. I attended class for two days, and I just stopped. I was doing drugs all day, laying around, sleeping. He found out a month or two later that I hadn’t been going to school and he got on my case, so I left. I took off and stayed with some friends and eventually ended back up in New Hampshire, back in my mother’s home.

I eventually got a job, and some of the adults I worked with convinced me that if I started going to school they would give me a raise. I decided I would save some money and go away to Florida. I would stay with my grandmother and try to start over. Still my mind was completely confused, but I was stuck in this game my mind made up for myself – so many separate realities. On one hand I was stuck in this game, and on another level I knew there was a bigger picture and I wanted to figure it out. I wasn’t ready to give up yet. I was still really lonely, sad and depressed, but there was something I wanted to figure out – what this life was about. That’s why I wanted to go to Florida to start over.

The day before I was leaving for Florida, I figured I would go out one more time and get really trashed. I ended up stealing two cars and breaking into and robbing two places and I was arrested the next day. I didn’t go to Florida but spent some time in juvenile detention instead. I ended up staying under house arrest. I felt like, “I have nothing. I can’t go anywhere. I can’t even leave my house.”

It really started to go downhill fast from there. I had to submit to random drug tests, but I didn’t stop using drugs so I failed all my tests. I was going to go to court and appear in front of the judge, but I ran away again the day before it happened. I went to Cleveland, Ohio, where I was born, and thought I would get a job, hide out for a while, and let everything pass. I wanted to live some sort of life. I had always been trying to be the bad-ass, and I realized this isn’t what I wanted. My mind turned from very violent to very gentle. I just wanted to live some sort of simple life and just be a human being. Eventually I went back to be with my family.

During that time when I ran away, I came to see how much I loved my family. I had spent so much time hating them, and I realized I loved them. If they had died when I was gone, I wouldn’t have been able to say goodbye to them. I realized how important some things in life really are, like the people we are close to. I could see how much love my parents have given me. I’m not saying I became a perfect kid, but I began to develop some respect.

What difference has the Dharma made in your mind?

On a practical level it’s unbelievable. It’s mind-blowing. Before, I would really freak out when any situation arose that confronted me. I would freak out and one emotion would completely overtake me, whether it was fear or anger.

Buddhism to me, the little that I know, is a way of dealing with the different states of mind. It’s a way to deal with it and control it and bring some balance into daily life. Buddhism is very practical to me. It’s given me antidotes, it’s given me alternatives to getting completely angry and wanting to take revenge. It’s given me the opportunity to recognize these things.

So it has helped you know your mind?

Yes. The different teachings I have heard have shown me that I can simply watch my mind, like looking in through a window and watching what happens – not getting entirely caught up in what’s happening, but just watching. It’s something I’ve never done. I always felt like the life I was living – this is it. I’m the main character and this is how I am, this is how I act. Buddhism has given me the sense that how I act in this movie, in this drama I am always caught up in, it’s just something we’re caught in – it’s a mind we’re caught in. In the middle of being caught up I can step back and watch what’s happening.

Buddhadharma has given me the opportunity and the power – since I am trying to integrate it into my life – to overcome the ordinary life, to deal with emotions. Usual methods don’t seem to address the emotions head on. Buddhism gives me the opportunity to actually address my anger and my fear, all my problems, and to deal with them skillfully. That’s the advantage it gives me.

Why did you decide to become a monk?

That’s a good question. I believe that what the Buddha taught is the way to my happiness. After being around Buddhism, being around Dharma practitioners and Buddhadharma, I saw things were different, these people are different. They are so kind and generous, and something must be behind that. Why are these people like this, why are their minds like this?

When I began to look at the teachings I started to believe that this is the way for a human being to deal with life. This is the way you come to understand. With faith in the Buddha and faith in yourself, this is the way to live your life. I can’t say it was an instant thing, but over a few months I began to see there was nothing else. If I wanted to change, to overcome my problems and try to help others overcome their problems, this is the way.

You couldn’t do that by getting married, having a family?

I have found that even being away from a Dharma center for a few days I would slip – slip into old patterns, old habits, old states of mind. That showed me I need to be near people who are supportive, I need to be in the right environment. It was very apparent at that time that I need to set up some restrictions for myself. I needed to do this for myself – not someone telling me, “Brandon, you need to do this, this and this.” Finally in my life, I need to take some responsibility.

So I decided that to make some serious commitment is the only way I could stay alive. It’s the only way I thought things could change – to really make a major commitment to myself. So often I fool myself by making minor commitments, I decided I have to make this serious commitment to really change. Also, some teachers encouraged me that this was the right thing to do.

Do you feel happy?

This is the happiest I’ve ever been. Unbelievable! I can’t think of any other time in my life that I was happy to wake up in the morning. Honestly, this is the one time.

Today, yesterday, and for the past month, I wake up and realize I am alive and feel like, “Life – unbelievable!” So much happiness! I realize I have another chance to change myself today, another chance to help someone else change themselves today – it’s unbelievably satisfying to know I have that opportunity. I have never had that before. I’ve never been happy before, and today I’m happy. I didn’t think that change would come. I was wrong. It happened slowly, but it happened.

When you see some of the older monks disrobing, do you feel afraid?

I guess in some ways I do. I think about myself in 40 years and wonder if I’m still going to want to be a monk. I think like that. But I don’t see that happening. I think about myself four years ago and I want to be a monk in 40 years. I have found something that in the past two months has given me happiness, which I wasn’t able to find in 20 years.

In my mind there is no doubt. If I was to reach a point where I decided to disrobe, it would show that something is terribly wrong. I hope that doesn’t happen – I pray that doesn’t happen.

If you could introduce one aspect of Dharma to a group where there was none, what part would you share?

What comes to mind is teaching people they have something inside themselves that is pure. They have something good inside of them – it’s there. It really is.

Along with the ideas of equanimity, knowing we are all beings who don’t want any pain, who just want to be happy and smile. Why should I have this strong emotion for you, but not for you and you? Those are the two things I would introduce to people, because those are the two things I feel that, if approached in the right manner, would lead to compassion. I wouldn’t teach compassion right away because it might be difficult – for me it was difficult to understand. The only way I got a taste of it was seeing that we have some of that purity inside of us, and in that way we are all the same.